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Economical Hatchbacks

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 07/21/05
07:54 AM

I recently test drove several hatchbacks (Scion xA, Kia Spectra5, Hyundai Elantra 5 dr, Suzuki Aerio & Reno, Ford Focus ZX3, Pontiac Vibe and Cheverolet Aveo), and thought I would share my experience here. I haven't yet bought my new car, so I would appreciate hearing about other people's experiences.

To start with, here's where I'm coming from and where I'm going:  I'm a 40-something guy sending my first kid to college.  My wife just finished her degree and will be teaching in the fall.  I've been driving a Ford Aspire for 10 years, and while it has given me a lot of great miles, I am ready for something new.  About the only option the Aspire has is a/c; my new car will have that, plus power windows & locks, keyless entry, cruise control, CD player, maybe even leather and a sunroof.  I like hatchback versatility, so the new car will have that as well.  The only constraint Mrs. Doohickie has put on me is that the new car have an automatic transmission; logistics get complicated when her car is in the shop since she doesn't drive a stick.  Basically, this car will be used for commuting, weekend trips to the building supply center, and as the backup when the family car is in the shop.  I have two sons over 6 feet, but one will be away at college starting in the fall, so rear seat room should be able to accommodate a tall person for short rides.

The first car I drove was the one that drew me into the thought of buying a new car:  the Scion xA.  I like the mileage:  well into the 30-mpg range in both city and highway.  It has surprising headroom for my 6'-2" frame.  In fact, headroom was not an issue with any of the cars I tested.  The interior finish could best be described as "efficient"; you could tell Toyota was trying to maintain quality while cutting cost.  It had one unique feature:  a compartment in the dashboard with a transluscent cover that can be lit from inside, referred to by insiders as "the microwave".  The overall aesthetics of the car are pleasing to my eyes, which is what made me want to drive it.  The automatic seemed to hang onto first gear much longer than I would expect, and the engine revved too much.  (I drove it again a week later and it didn't seem too bad; I suspect the OD was turned off the first time to produce more power.)  I was disappointed, though, by the ride.  This thing is a small car with a hard sport-tuned suspension.  It was probably made worse by the optional 17-inch wheels.  There is no way I could ride in that car for 100k miles.  Right now, it's the only xA on the lot; if they get one in with stock wheels and tires, I may try it again.

Next up:  Hyundai Elantra 5-door.  This car is lauded by many as an indication of how far Hyundai has come.  Maybe my expectations were too high, but in my opinion Hyundai is not there yet.  The car is a good combination of value (a fully loaded GT with leather seats and AT, with incentives, for less than $15k), room, fuel efficiency, and luxury.  But it seemed like in every area, things were a little compromised.  The interior was not up to par with the xA, the acceleration off the line was slow (although okay once the car was up to speed) and it just felt like an old late-80s Chevy Spectrum econobox, handling-wise.  The car I drove was not a GT; perhaps the GT handles better and if I take a second drive I'll make sure to get one.  The styling of the car, while overall is pleasing, just doesn't grab me.

The Spectra5, on the other hand, looks sharp.  I read somewhere that it was designed by the same guy who did the Mazda3 5 door, and you can tell.  It's a nice little knockoff.  (While I love the Mazda3 styling, I don't think they provide good value for the money and haven't driven one.)  Although it is supposedly a big step up for Kia, the Spectra5 interior still seems a little sub-par to me.  But if it is sporty enough, I could live with it.  Even though it supposedly has a sport suspension, it was much smoother than the xA, and I liked that.  When I got to the end of the block, I had to make a left-hand turn.  In my Aspire, it would have been easy, but when I stepped on the Spectra5's gas pedal, it seemed like nothing happened for a long time.  Similar to the Elantra, it really had no pickup off the line.  It was okay once you were moving, but liked to rev and the engine noise came through.  Apparently, the Spectra5 and Elantra now share a platform since Kia was acquired by Hyundai.  This was evidenced by the fact that both cars had a slight vibration in the wheel at 70 mph.  This is apparently a known phenomenon to Hyundai on at least some Elantras, although they don't like to admit it.

I figured I would drive the Suzukis just so I could cross them off my list.  Maybe it was because I had low expectations after testing the Spectra5 and Elantra, but I really liked both Suzukis, probably the best balance of handling, power, sound system, and quality of materials & finish of any cars I've driven yet.
 
I drove the Reno first. My first impression of the car's interior is that of an upscale sedan (it is a close cousin to the Forenza, and maybe they didn't bother to "cheap it out" for the hatchback version?) Nice carpets, gray seats with dark patterned seating areas, very clean dash and instruments. I got behind the wheel, pulled to the edge of the parking lot, hit the gas, and WOW. It's no muscle car, but after the anemic Spectra and Elantra, its 2.0L had very nice torque off the line. It shifted very deliberately but smoothly, pretty much at the points I would shift if I were driving a manual. Sure, it leaned a little in turns, but it always felt predictable and in control. At speeds up to 80 mph, it was rock-solid (I didn't go faster than that). It has a sunroof which didn't noticeably cut into my headroom. My overall impression of this car was that of a very upscale car. The biggest knock against the car is fuel economy; it only gets 22 mpg city/30 hwy.
 
The Aerio has a whole different flavor. With a 2.3L, 155 hp engine, there is more power for about the same weight. The reviews point out that the Aerio has problems with engine and wind noise; I could hear that. The engine was worst when negotiating parking lots... at low rpms, the vibration got into the cabin more. On the road this was much less noticeable. On the freeway, though, there was a constant, smooth "whoosh". Most cars I've driven with wind noise problems sound more turbulent; apparently the flow over the Aerio is very smooth. It leaned when challenging corners, but the handling was just what I would expect of a car with a high aspect. And without even trying too hard, I found myself at 85 mph. The only clue was the wind whoosh. The interior isn't as upscale as the Reno, but apparently the dash is new for this year and was very straightforward. The fabric on the seats looked like it might not be the most durable, though. But this car has lots and lots of headroom and storage space.
 
The road feel was more pronounced (both in a good and bad way) in the Aerio than the Reno. At least in both cars, you felt connected to the road. The Hyundai and Kia felt more like cats trying to cross a stream without getting their paws wet. The stereos were far superior in the Reno and Aerio as well. The Reno's single disc CD-Radio was more than competent. It didn't have a boomy sound at all. The Aerio's sound system included a 6-disc changer and a subwoofer, which provided excellent sound without being too boomy.

Next up was the Ford Focus.  The ride and acceleration of the Focus were very good- most similar to the Reno out of the other cars I had driven.  Good power, good shifting, good fuel economy.  It would be a great car if I didn't have nagging worries about the early Focus years (I know two people who had them replaced under lemon law).  The one thing I didn't like was the interior design.  I can't say they did anything wrong there; it just doesn't match my tastes.  A good car for the money, but all too common these days.

Pontiac Vibe:  I like the overall look of the car.  It has decent power, but it was rather gravelly in delivering it.  The handling made the car seem bigger than it was, but not in a good way:  I felt like I was driving a minivan.  There was a premium GM Typhoon soundsystem in it, but it sounded terrible:  Too much bass, and the quality of the base was very boomy.  I tried equalizing it to something I could enjoy, but gave up.  It's an okay car, but really a little bigger than I'm looking for.  Where the Aerio had a nicely carpeted cargo area with little bins under the floor, the Vibe was all plastic which I didn't like.

The most recent car I drove was the Chevy Aveo.  One thing I don't like about it is that you cannot get cruise control.  I suppose a dealer could add it, but I haven't confirmed that.  One of the things I really liked about the Aveo is the mileage- almost as high as the xA.  Where it beats the xA is in ride quality.  It has a surprisingly much smoother ride (at the expense of leaning heavily in corners) which I preferred to the xA's harshness.  It is a great car in a small package for a lot less than the xA.  But the package is just a little too small; rear seat headroom is in short supply, even in the wagon.  If I were were I was ten years ago when I bought the Aspire, I would probably choose the Aveo over the Aspire.  But I'm looking for a little more this time.

My younger son (who will likely get this purchase in about 5 years as a college car) has fallen in love with the Scion xB. I haven't driven that yet, but I think at this point, my three top candidates are the Reno, the xA and the Focus (I have a good history with Fords). If I had a better sense of the Reno's reliability and it had a little better mileage, it would be Reno hands down. I won't be buying for a couple months, yet, so it is premature to start comparing prices, since deals will probably be available for model year-end.

Does anyone out there have experience with any of these hatchbacks to share?  My favorite car overall is the Reno, but its pedigree (made by Daewoo in Korea which was bought in bankruptcy by GM and Suzuki, with an Australian Holden-design engine, sold in the U.S. as a Suzuki and in Canada as a Chevy) gives me cause for concern.  I think the Reno is either the steal of the pack and I'll be looked at as a visionary for buying one in the early days, or Suzuki will walk away from the model in a year or two and I'll be stuck with an orphan.

Decisions, decisions!
 

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 07/21/05
05:58 PM

Update:  I stopped by the Toyota dealer this afternoon and guess what?  They had another Scion xA there- one without the dropped springs an 17 inch wheels- a totally stock unit.  I stopped in an my salesman was there and we took her out.  It was a helluva smoother ride than it was with the tricked out stuff.  Still not as smooth as the Reno I'm pretty sure, but not near as objectionable as the other xA was.  

This one had the AT, six-disc changer and armrest (yes, it's an option and not standard on an xA), but does not have the keyless entry or cruise control.  The salesman said they could add cruise and I assume they could add the keyless/alarm option as well if I wanted it.  Logically, this is the car for me.  Now I need to decide if I can live with the teeny car ride and whether the ride quality is acceptable.  The dealer also said they had a no payments for 45 days option which would bring me a lot closer in terms of timespan.  

So if our illustrious state legislature can finance the public school system, thus ensuring my wife's income, I might be able to move more quickly than I thought I would.  

 
madmax madmax
New User | Posts: 7 | Joined: 08/05
Posted: 08/16/05
01:50 PM

Myself being a economy box car freak, I have looked over all of the cars you spoke about for myself. If its fuel economy and proven reliability go for the Scion(toyota made)  if you can afford a littel more go for the Suzuki, were I live a lot of people are getting them for their peppy engine and good history (suzuki jeeps were excellent). My frind just got a Aerio and I would recommend it over the Toyota Corolla, very nice indeed

 

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 08/30/05
09:56 AM

Update:  I still haven't bought, but came close this weekend.  My wife just started a new job and doesn't get her first paycheck until tomorrow, and she wanted to see how much it really is before we commit to a car payment.  This weekend, I went to look at a Ford Focus at a dealer.  My biggest obstacle to the Focus is that all the hatchbacks some in black-on-black or gray-on-black interiors.  I had only seen (and not liked) the black ones, and went to see a gray one at a dealer that was about a half hour drive from my house.  The gray interior is tolerable.  I took it for a test drive, and it was okay; the biggest problem was the tire noise at highway speeds.  Also, it was a 3-door and I would prefer a 5-door.  But the salesguy suddenly had me in with the manager who was offering me twice as much for my trade in (sight unseen) as I thought I could sell it for.  Tempting!  They wrote up papers, and tried to get me to sign on the dotted line.  I told them no deal until I was ready to close, which meant I had to go back and get my trade in car.

On the way home, I stopped at a Hyundai dealer and redrove an Elantra.  The Focus definitely handles better (feels more glued to the road), but the Elantra definitely has better road manners (smoother ride).  The Hyundai dealer tried to get me to buy as well, but a coworker of mine wants to buy my old car for his son, and my wife wants to wait for her paycheck.

So here I sit:  I think I've settled on the Elantra, but 05 stocks are being depleted and I'm not quite ready to pull the trigger.  If I can't get an Elantra the way I want it, I may go for a Kia Spectra5 which is a close cousin to the Elantra and is updated.

I was really intrigued by the Suzukis, but Suzuki came last in a recent initial quality survey, and their management seems to be more worried about pointing fingers at Daewoo and GM than managing the problem.  I think Suzuki will turn it around and back large gains, but the 05s are already built and no changes to their production lines will affect them.  Also, mileage, especially on the Reno, lags behind competitive models (and on Suzuki forums owners seem to be having trouble even meeting those low numbers).

I think I've ruled out the Focus at this point; it's not quite what I want.  It never really was, but the prices are so good with current incentives I felt I had to give it a good look.

The Elantra has dated styling, but that's about the worst I can say about the car.  If I buy the Spectra5, the styling is there (although the ride is a little more harsh than the Elantra).  So, barring any new discoveries (for instance if the the new 06 Kia Rio5 turns out to be attractive), I think it will be one of these two cars.  

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 08/30/05
10:00 AM

Oh, and as for the Scion:  I don't like the boxy xB, and the xA, I've decided, is just a little too small for me.  

 
CrunchyCookie CrunchyCookie
User | Posts: 153 | Joined: 01/05
Posted: 08/30/05
10:20 AM

You can't really say Suzuki's pointing the finger; its sudden influx of Daewoo copies and the sudden crash-down in quality are directly related.  I can't believe you think of the Reno as an upscale car, but don't hold that against the Aerio.

I'm the test driver guy around here; if you're interested, here's my full take on the Aerio, Forenza/Reno, and Focus.

If hatchback fans are wagon fans, you might want to check out any of these:

T
wo small frys:
1. Scion xA
2. Kia Rio Cinco
and 11 compacts:
3. Toyota Matrix (and Pontiac Vibe)
4. Mazda 3
5. Mitsubishi Lancer Ralliart
6. Subaru Impreza (and Saab 9-2X)
7. Suzuki Aerio
8. VW Jetta
9. Ford Focus
10. Chevrolet HHR (next month)
11. Chrysler PT Cruiser
12. Kia Spectra 5
13. Suzuki Forenza

Since the Lancer just died, I'd get the Vibe or the Mazda.  They'll last the longest, hold four adults, have decent resale value, and drive the best aside from the Focus.

PS - Scions can't have cruise control.
 

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 08/30/05
02:10 PM

You can't really say Suzuki's pointing the finger; its sudden influx of Daewoo copies and the sudden crash-down in quality are directly related. I can't believe you think of the Reno as an upscale car, but don't hold that against the Aerio.

Sure I can, and I'm not saying that there is no relation.  However, when a company representative makes public statements criticizing production partners, it points to lots of infighting and out-of-control production processes.  I've worked in the auto industry and car companies take great pains to put the best spin on such statements.  If they simply point to the other guy and say it's his fault, there is no bright side to be had.

I'm the test driver guy around here; if you're interested, here's my full take on the
Aerio, Forenza/Reno, and Focus.

Yep, I've read them.  The Aerio is a nice little package with a big interior.  But I've read on owner forums of several people who had major problems (engine, transmission) just out of the 36,000 mile warranty and Suzuki trying to say they are are not drivetrain (?!?) or are due to poor maintenance when people have maintenance records.  One dealer tried to say the person had put the wrong oil in, when the dealer was the only shop that had changed the oil on the car.

My feeling that the Reno is "upscale" comes from two aspects:  (1) Nice interior (which your review agrees with); and, (2) Sound deadening which minimizes the feeling the engine is straining for lack of power.  The Reno, though, is one of those cars that contributed to the poor initial quality, which scares me off.

The Focus is a good handling car, but I'm looking for a highway cruiser for commuting.  It had much more road noise than, say, the Reno or Elantra, on my test drives.  And the interior design and fit & finish of the Focus leaves a lot to be desired.

Since the Lancer just died, I'd get the Vibe or the Mazda. They'll last the longest, hold four adults, have decent resale value, and drive the best aside from the Focus.

The Vibe is very upright, almost like an SUV.  On bumpy roads, this produces a forward-and-back galloping sensation that I just don't like.  The Mazda is a fine car, maybe even a great one.  And costs at least 20% more than I will pay for my next car.

PS - Scions can't have cruise control.

Wanna bet?  It's a regional option.  If you cost out a Scion xA plugging in a Texas Zip Code (such as 76xxx), you see that "Speed Control" is an option available for $275.  I asked whether they just used a Toyota cruise control unit, and the dealer said it was a Scion-branded part.
 

 
CrunchyCookie CrunchyCookie
User | Posts: 153 | Joined: 01/05
Posted: 08/30/05
05:44 PM

The Toyota PR guy tells me that's not real Toyota cruise control; it's aftermarket installed by dealers.  Which could be added onto any car.  Only the tC comes with factory cruise.

You found the Vibe upright, eh?  I thought it was just tall; you don't sit any higher physically.  The only thing I didn't like was limited rearward seat travel and a too-far-away steering wheel.

If you're passing on the 3 for the Elantra just on price, know that you'll probably end up losing money when it's time to sell.  We're talking best-in-class resale vs. worst-in-class -- mid-$11s vs. $18K among the 2004 class.
 

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 08/31/05
07:13 AM

I'm aware of the price break on resale.  My ownership history is as follows:

84 Ford Tempo:  sold to junkyard with 125k miles
72 Dodge Dart:  sold with 180k miles
87 Dodge 600:  sold with 120k miles
90 Plymouth Sundance:  traded in with 90k miles
95 Ford Escort:  now driven by son; 111k miles
95 Ford Aspire:  my current commuter; 117k miles
03 Ford Taurus:  wife's car; 60k miles (high mileage while commuting to college; she has a local job now)

My point is that I'm not particularly worried about resale, as I tend to drive my cars past 100k miles.  The car I'm about to buy I plan to use as my commuter for 5-6 years then hand it down to my younger son as a college car.  A Hyundai will be under full warranty up to that point and the drivetrain warranty will still be in effect.  

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 08/31/05
07:17 AM

Oh, and on the Scion cruise control:  It is marketed by Scion as an option in some areas.  My local dealer said it was an authentic Scion part (it's available as an option in this area).  In areas where it is not available as an option, I'm sure a dealer would gladly install an aftermarket part.  That is probably the case where you (and your Toyota PR guy) live.  

 
CrunchyCookie CrunchyCookie
User | Posts: 153 | Joined: 01/05
Posted: 08/31/05
09:30 AM

That's the way to do it all right...  Though a 95 Civic EX is still worth about $4,300 and a 95 Elantra GLS $1,800.  So you might have to go way more than ten years.  Another thing: Hyundai's engines seem pretty abysmal on fuel economy for their size.  That might add to the value equation a bit.

I'm getting an xA from Toyota this Friday for a 1,000-mile drive.  I'll see how it goes.
 

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 09/01/05
07:22 AM

I like the concept of the xA:  Inexpensive, fuel effecient, yet stylish transportation.  In execution, though, I have the following issues with it:  

  1. It really is smaller than I am normally comfortable with (there are three 6-footers in my family, and I personally feel crowded in the drivers seat).
  2. As a Texas resident, the a/c seems a little weak, and this is made worse by the dark colors of the interior (especially the dark gray dashboard).
  3. It may have "Toyota quality" but it's a rough-riding buzzbox nevertheless.

That being said, with gas prices going up the xA is looking better all the time.

 

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 09/01/05
07:34 AM

Oh- further rumination on the a/c:  It seems as though the obvious explanation is that the engine is too anemic on the xA at about 100 hp.  But my Escort Wagon only has 88 hp, is cooling a larger cabin area, and does a much better job doing it.  

Maybe the xA has essentially and underdrive pulley which limits the power available to accessories including the a/c compressor?  

 
CrunchyCookie CrunchyCookie
User | Posts: 153 | Joined: 01/05
Posted: 09/01/05
10:52 AM

Everyone seems to agree on the xA being a rough rider; Consumer Reports actually gave it a 1 out of 5.  It has a rear stabilizer bar the Echo does not, 15-inch wheels the Echo does not, everything's tuned stiffer, and that's a light car with a crappy torsion beam rear.

If you can wait, the Echo-replacing Yaris will be here in mid-2006.
 

 
Doohickie Doohickie
New User | Posts: 26 | Joined: 07/05
Posted: 09/01/05
10:41 PM

I *can* wait, but I don't *want* to.  ;- )

I drove by the local Hyundai dealer this evening and noticed their Elantras were all red tagged.  Unfortunately, they didn't have the combination I want (5 door GLS AT, not particularly loaded), but perhaps all the area Hyundai dealers are doing the same thing?  Also, the Kia dealer had a truckload of new Spec5s to offload.  I may be glad I've waited.

With gas prices rising, the xA, the Aveo, and maybe the 06 Kia Rio5 might be worth another look.  

 
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