Automotive Forums

I came across your posting on the automotive.com message board.  I also have a 2005 Honda Odyssey Touring and am looking into replacing the pax system wheels and tires.  Sounds like using the EX parts is the way to go, just have a few questions.

1.  I was on the Hondapartswarehouse.com site and wanted to verify the part numbers of what you bought.
42700-SHJ-C91  DISK (16x7J) (wheel)
44732-S0X-A01  CAP
06421-SHJ-A00  WHEEL KIT, TEMPR
06421-SCV-A00  SENSOR ASSY., TPMS
42751-GYR-034  SPARE TIRE

2.  Did the wheel nuts from the PAX wheels fit the EX wheels?

3.  Does the TPMS operate the same as it did with PAX?

Thanks,

Jerry Hale
haleshouse@bellsouth.net  

JerryR:
My Odyssey is at Belle Tire right now having all four tires replaced to the tune of $1,000. I don't feel too bad about it since I have 55,000 miles on the original Pax tires. Probably could have gone another 5-8,000 miles but with winter coming, I didn't want to wait. Yes, it's a lot of $$ for a set of tires but I likely would have paid $600 or more for "regular" tires and the peace of mind offered by the Pax system is somewhat comforting. The Honda dealer where I purchased the van wanted $1,700!!! I sure hope that the dealers are warning potential buyers of what to expect when it comes time for tire replacement. Here in Toledo, Ohio, there are only three Michelin dealers who can even handle the replacement and two of them are the local Honda dealers.

We have an Odyssey Touring and I am concerned abut the cost of replacing the tires.  I take it that you replaced your tires with Michelin PAX tires and that Bell Tire was able to do this?  Do you know if all Belle Tire locations have this capability/pricing or if there are only select locations that can service the PAX system?  

October 22 07 I was told I needed new tires.  36,000 miles on them.  I asked them to contact Michelin.  Came back in 3 days and Honda dealer said they didn't need to talk to me until the tires were 2/32 worn.  I had 2@ 4/32 and 1@ 3/32.  I replaced one.  Went to St. Louis where I had a flat October 28.  Honda dealer got me into different tires/wheels...btw there is a backlog of sensors nationwide so I don't have a spare tire.  Cost $1,714.  Michelin said Honda should have called them so they could request the worn tires and confirm the problem, act like they are suprised at my luck.  CALL 1-877-729-8473 Mich POC concerning these tires.  RUN Around..Honda says one thing/Mich says another. BUT no one is at fault.  I'm out of tires but until I can find a sensor I have no spare tire.  

This is a reply on the positive side, the PAX Tires. I earlier wrote a negative..
PAX tires pluses, the tire I found to be great in the snow, I rarely spun out they had fairly good luck with traction. With the Honda traction control, I passed several large 4X4’s on snow pack that were spinning and I am sure just pissed them off. “A VAN passed me…with no chains.”
WA is CA relocated. They have very little experience with snow here. Just as in Little Rock CA they close everything if it snows 2 inches. Folks literally abandon there vehicles where ever they happen to be, 07’ was a banner year for snow. Michelin PAX tires run great on snow with their softer rubber. Just as retreads drive better with sawdust in the rubber. The PAX soft rubber and a good tread design like Sperry topsider boat shoes or a good Vibram sole I’m sure pushes them along in the snow by not slipping. East Coast Ice would be another factor but four wheel drives even fear ice which simply means all four tires will slide if engaged with torque.
Having driven a new two wheel drive Toyota Land cruiser in the snow, back east I learned it was a pig slipping and sliding compared to this Honda it had a terrible traction control system and distribution of weight. Unlike the Toyota 240Z which had perfect weight distribution.

While driving the roads last year around here in Seattle and on the way to Snoqualmie Ski resorts you could simply watch your outside temperature to rate the amount of Ice on the road. The Odyssey Touring begins to lose traction at high speeds when the temperature goes approx. below 30 degrees.
Other positives Honda and Michelin have warranted a percentage of the tires I’ve replaced. Michelin Paid for an expensive flat repair  The high cost of flats might come down if they can plug the tire instead of patching and it sounds like some of the Seattle Honda’s are now going to start offering that where initially they wouldn’t. Just like COSCO would not do a flat repair on a Z rated tires until just recently in the last four years. I’m sure it’s just the bottom line. And oh ya you don’t have to get out in the snow to change a flat. The 18in wheels and tires seem to have good ground clearance in snow pack. Thats all Ive got.  

David, what did you do for a spare tire?  

Will a full size spare fit in the "lazy susan" storage area under the passenger area floor?  

I know I'm new on this forum, but I had a similar problem.  I finally determined that the recommended tire pressure was too low (33-35 psi).  After replacing the first set at 22,000 due to the edges being completely bald, I am running this set at 38-40 psi.  I now have 34,000 on them with over half the tread left.  I hope this helps someone else before they spend money on rims they might not need.

On another note, ask whether the shop replacing the tires has a 2nd Gen PAX machine.  According to my tire shop the 2nd Gen machine cuts install time in 1/4.  It was going to cost $300 more to have them changed locally.  I drove 50 miles and saved $300.  The devil is definitely in the details.  

I just swapped out the PAX tires from my 2005 Odyssey, with 17" wheels taken-off from an Acura RL.
The RL wheels spec:  Bolt Pattern 5-120; offset: 55mm;

Tire spec:  Kumho Solus KH16 235/60TR17 (listed at tiretack $80); rolling diameter: ~28"

I got the wheel/tire/sensor package from a guy (the wheels are used).  The wheels look go.  The tires are quiet.  The sensors work (not on the first try, there were some mix-up).  You can contact Mike acurahondaoem@hotmail.com or 408-829-5302.  He is located in San Jose.  I did a local pickup.

I don't know what the offset is on the original PAX, but with 55mm, I have no problem.  I double checked the speed with my GPS, the speedometer reads true.

on the way I learned these facts:
- Palo Alto Honda dealer, waits $95 for fixing a puncture and $285 per tire for replacement.
- my Honda dealer, told me they cannot replace PAX with stock Honda wheels, because there are not combination of wheels and tire that has the correct rolling diameter. (lie)
- Local Wheelworks store was willing to fix me with a set of after-market wheels, until they talked the Honda dealer to get the bolt pattern and details. The dealer told them that the bolt pattern are offset are special, and nothing will fit.  I thank them because they were at least nice enough try.
- If you buy new wheels and tires from Tirerack, they will mount and balance them for you and if you car use a TPMS, they will also install the sensor for.  That is until I mention that I have a Touring, then they say there are nothing in their stock that will fit that car. (lie)  

I have an 05 Honda Odyssey Touring model as well.  I have had nighmare experiences with the PAX system.  I have been trying to figure out what to do with the tires before winter hits here in Wisconsin.  I've contacted dealers, Michelin, numerous wheel/tire websites and businesses and no one could offer me advice with my situation.  Finally I found buywheelstoday.com and they suggested wheels to fit my van that was also compatible with sensors.  I had several choices and the price wasn't bad ($159 each) but then I was locked in with not many choices on the tire aspect of things.  I bought 17 inch wheels but if you go with a 16 inch you will have more options as far as finding tires that are compatible.  I then found a local tire place Waukegan Tire that services PAX tires and they were able to break down my PAX tires take the sensors out and reuse them.  I ended up with Michelin tires but they are great and were $150 each.  With everything completed I still fell short of what it would have costed me to replace just one set of PAX tires.  And I have the peace of mind when I get a flat it won't cost me an arm and a leg to replace and they will be able to service me anywhere in the country.  There is a storage place for a spare tire in the back left side of the van....it already has a jack so I am just calling around the bone yards to find a spare which should be easy and relatively inexpensive.  
I am here to say that what Honda is trying to pull is a HOAX.......it's not a PAX system it's just a tire/wheel supplied by Michelin that has an extra heavy belted wheel that makes the run flats a run flat.  However, it doesn't mess with your suspension as Honda is telling people and they cannot void your warranty over switched out to lighter conventional wheels/tires.  So if anyone has questions about what I did you can email me at cblaim@verizon.net and I'll let you know what I know.  Don't fall into the trap that Honda is trying to pull.  

Is anybody trying to put together a class action suit? This sitaution is a disgrace and should be an embarassment for both Michellin and Honda. I've had the same nightmares that you have and am in the process of replacing them with regular tires.

They shouldn't get away with this. You don't use a high end vehicle as a guinea pig for an experimental tire system that is extreemly expensive and can't be maintained by regualr tire dealers. The sad thing is that they knew about this and rolled the dice anyway. Only it's us who crapped out.  

JerryR:
My Odyssey is at Belle Tire right now having all four tires replaced to the tune of $1,000. I don't feel too bad about it since I have 55,000 miles on the original Pax tires. Probably could have gone another 5-8,000 miles but with winter coming, I didn't want to wait. Yes, it's a lot of $$ for a set of tires but I likely would have paid $600 or more for "regular" tires and the peace of mind offered by the Pax system is somewhat comforting. The Honda dealer where I purchased the van wanted $1,700!!! I sure hope that the dealers are warning potential buyers of what to expect when it comes time for tire replacement. Here in Toledo, Ohio, there are only three Michelin dealers who can even handle the replacement and two of them are the local Honda dealers.

swissguy1:
We have an Odyssey Touring and I am concerned abut the cost of replacing the tires.  I take it that you replaced your tires with Michelin PAX tires and that Bell Tire was able to do this?  Do you know if all Belle Tire locations have this capability/pricing or if there are only select locations that can service the PAX system?

Sorry for the long delay in replying - I don't check this forum very often. No, not all Belle Tire locations can handle the PAX system. The Belle Tire I used here in Toledo was the only one of several in the area that could handle the PAX tires.  

Here's an idea there mr lawsuit happy, rotate your tires!!!! You can't provide proof of rotation because you did not ever rotate your tires, but that's ok, go make another bogus case against the big bad car manufacturer because you don't know how to take care of a car....that's going to help the price of cars drop isn't it?? Have a nice lawsuit.  

cblaim:
I have an 05 Honda Odyssey Touring model as well.  I have had nighmare experiences with the PAX system.  I have been trying to figure out what to do with the tires before winter hits here in Wisconsin.  I've contacted dealers, Michelin, numerous wheel/tire websites and businesses and no one could offer me advice with my situation.  Finally I found buywheelstoday.com and they suggested wheels to fit my van that was also compatible with sensors.  I had several choices and the price wasn't bad ($159 each) but then I was locked in with not many choices on the tire aspect of things.  I bought 17 inch wheels but if you go with a 16 inch you will have more options as far as finding tires that are compatible.  I then found a local tire place Waukegan Tire that services PAX tires and they were able to break down my PAX tires take the sensors out and reuse them.  I ended up with Michelin tires but they are great and were $150 each.  With everything completed I still fell short of what it would have costed me to replace just one set of PAX tires.  And I have the peace of mind when I get a flat it won't cost me an arm and a leg to replace and they will be able to service me anywhere in the country.  There is a storage place for a spare tire in the back left side of the van....it already has a jack so I am just calling around the bone yards to find a spare which should be easy and relatively inexpensive.  
I am here to say that what Honda is trying to pull is a HOAX.......it's not a PAX system it's just a tire/wheel supplied by Michelin that has an extra heavy belted wheel that makes the run flats a run flat.  However, it doesn't mess with your suspension as Honda is telling people and they cannot void your warranty over switched out to lighter conventional wheels/tires.  So if anyone has questions about what I did you can email me at cblaim@verizon.net and I'll let you know what I know.  Don't fall into the trap that Honda is trying to pull.

Honda Odyssey= High end vehicle??? When did I miss that update?  

joeroe23:
Is anybody trying to put together a class action suit? This sitaution is a disgrace and should be an embarassment for both Michellin and Honda. I've had the same nightmares that you have and am in the process of replacing them with regular tires.

They shouldn't get away with this. You don't use a high end vehicle as a guinea pig for an experimental tire system that is extreemly expensive and can't be maintained by regualr tire dealers. The sad thing is that they knew about this and rolled the dice anyway. Only it's us who crapped out.

Honda Odyssey minivan= High end vehicle???  

cblaim:
I have an 05 Honda Odyssey Touring model as well.  I have had nighmare experiences with the PAX system.  I have been trying to figure out what to do with the tires before winter hits here in Wisconsin.  I've contacted dealers, Michelin, numerous wheel/tire websites and businesses and no one could offer me advice with my situation.  Finally I found buywheelstoday.com and they suggested wheels to fit my van that was also compatible with sensors.  I had several choices and the price wasn't bad ($159 each) but then I was locked in with not many choices on the tire aspect of things.  I bought 17 inch wheels but if you go with a 16 inch you will have more options as far as finding tires that are compatible.  I then found a local tire place Waukegan Tire that services PAX tires and they were able to break down my PAX tires take the sensors out and reuse them.  I ended up with Michelin tires but they are great and were $150 each.  With everything completed I still fell short of what it would have costed me to replace just one set of PAX tires.  And I have the peace of mind when I get a flat it won't cost me an arm and a leg to replace and they will be able to service me anywhere in the country.  There is a storage place for a spare tire in the back left side of the van....it already has a jack so I am just calling around the bone yards to find a spare which should be easy and relatively inexpensive.  
I am here to say that what Honda is trying to pull is a HOAX.......it's not a PAX system it's just a tire/wheel supplied by Michelin that has an extra heavy belted wheel that makes the run flats a run flat.  However, it doesn't mess with your suspension as Honda is telling people and they cannot void your warranty over switched out to lighter conventional wheels/tires.  So if anyone has questions about what I did you can email me at cblaim@verizon.net and I'll let you know what I know.  Don't fall into the trap that Honda is trying to pull.

scott30cal:
Honda Odyssey= High end vehicle??? When did I miss that update?

sorry wrong posting