Automotive Forums  Where Car Enthusiasts Go to Discuss Cars Online

Sept 2007

Update to my previous message. I have since changed out all my PAX tires and rims which cost me $1700 (wheels, tires, sensors, mounting, balance). I installed new alloy rims and Michelin Tires found on the EX model. I made this choice so that there was the least likelyhood of a comapibilty problem. I did have to use the Touring pressure sensors instead of the EX sensors. I used the caps off the PAX wheels (they fit). It works great and I have peace of mind knowing I can go anyhwere and have my tires repaired or replaced.

I have 5 PAX tires and rims for sale. Two new tires with 600 miles each, one of the rims is new, 3 wheels and three tires with about 15000 miles, one rim has a scratch) for sale. All are mounted with sensors. Make offer!!  

I am interested. I live in FL. Would you possibly be local? If not, would you ship?

Thanks for the response.  

Here is another possible solution to this nightmare. I bought 4 new rims (original honda odyssey, EX, EXl model) which fit perfectly on the touring. I then bought Michelin 235/65/16 (made for Ex or EXL) and put the touring sensors in the new rims. I was able to buy the rims from e-bay and the whole thing cost the same as replacing the 4 Pax tires. Now I have tires that anyone can change, sensors that work with my vehicle and all is good. I would caution you that you really need to find someone who knows what they are doing or the sensors may not work. I am very glad to have put this nightmare behind me and I hope we win the lawsuit against Honda and Michelin.

David  

I just did the same as well. Thanks for the update  

You can but it will be very expensive.  

Its too bad Honda bought into this Michelin PAX system. Caveman says "Odyssey good, Michelin screw up...", Touring is a miss interpretation of the Vans name. Seattle offers Flat repairs most dealers 60.00 Utah Larry H Miller 96.17. Tires cost 264.01 to 189.00 one tire same dealer. Plus there is Gel pax and labor cost.

Initially before the Honda got the 50k machine to fix there own tires you could purchase a tire rim everything, one tire 550.00 at last check over 700.00 for same thing. Thus I still have no spare.  Problems with tires, chunks of tire fall off, on two tires replaced, Bead pop out of rim on another, inside ridge bald wear out down to threads this was the most common wear down. I’ve only had one flat. I have replaced 5 tires so far and spent near 2000 dollars on repairs plus the constant nagging of visits to Honda practically on a bi-monthly basis it seems for this and other maintenance. In SLC when they broke additional parts on my car the dealer asked if they could use generic parts to replace their mistake. That was the biggest laugh, right there the dealers are not even standing behind there own Honda products, nor do they try to help each other out. The Dealer that broke my 800.00 part on a Oil change while on Vacation I could not get the Dealer in my home town to give that Dealer a price brake on the parts even though they were both able to get the Honda Wholesale price. They are all out for themselves. But that just kills me when you service only at Honda and Honda dealers ask you to go some place else for the repair.  So why cant they do the same thing for the PAX problem on a less than 3 year old car less than 40k. I believe there lawyers and Michelin have advised them not to, plus they just bought into that expensive machine that hardly any tire dealer will buy into. They are as they say in bed together Motto and Michelin Man.
I have had a lot of other problems and its been difficult to not say I Hate this Van. But I have been on a Honda since I was 12 driving dirt bikes; They have a lot of products, good tight motors but America’s European influenced 17.5 in rim with a non common 5 lug on 120 mm rim limits this beast. There is the 18 in rim replacement that Discount Auto will do with low profiles and TPMS sensor installed on the stem. The sensor cost 75.00 to 100.00 each tire. My intent might be to replace the set of tires until I decide to sell the car. So not only do the tires weigh in at a 100lbs extra weight, now Im looking at having to store the Michelin Mans heap, while I run on some real tires that don’t cost a kings ransom, and have free flat repairs if needed.

Honda needs to step up and offer a choice. After all America is all about choice, the freedom to choose. Maybe they dont really understand the American public.  

Hi pjcesq,

My wife and I are purchasing a 2007 Honda Ody Touring edition within the next month. I see in your post you purchased conventional tires and rims once your run flats wore out.  I also see you purchased a TMPS from Honda.  Can you tell me what your approx. costs were for the everything?  

The run flats that are being sold with these cars are total garbage in my opinion.  Thanks for your help.  

Do you still have your 5 pax tires for sale? would you accept 50.00 plus shipping for the lot  

We have a 2005 Odyssey Touring with 37,000 miles on it.  We have been through 7 Pax tires - 6 due to wear on the inner and outer tread shoulders, and one due to a nail.  At 15,000 miles we went through our first pair, and was told it was due to alignment.  We also had a nail in another tire at that time.  I had them replaced at COOP City Tire in the Bronx, a trip from New Jersey, but the nearest Michelin dealer that could service PAX tires.  We also had the nail fixed.  The cost for two new tires mounted and balanced was over $500 and the cost to fix the nail was about $90.  After buying the two new tires, I found a Honda dealer that had alignment equipment which could work with the Pax wheels - not every Honda dealer has this equipment.  The alignment was spot on - but Honda has cranked so much caster into the front end that causes the tires to wear prematurely on both shoulders of the tread.  A 4 page nasty letter to Honda and Michelin resulted in a check for the cost of the nail from Michelin and a check for the cost of the tires from Honda.

The next time we had a nail in a tire, I called Michelin and told them I wasn't taking any more Lewis & Clark expeditions to the Bronx at 6:00 AM, dropping off my car when they open and then taking the subway to work in Manhattan for the privilege of paying $90 to fix a nail.   They gave me a claim number and my Honda dealer gave me a complete new wheel and tire for free.

25,000 miles or so and two more tires were worn out on the tread shoulders.  This time I was able to buy complete new PAX wheel/tire assemblies from my local Honda dealer for $200 each.

Fast forward to 37,000 miles and my Honda dealer tells me I need two more tires - worn out on the shoulders of the tread.  But guess what, now they have the equipment to mount PAX tires.  So now a PAX tire is $200 and they will mount them on my wheels for $92 each.  I told them no thanks at this point.

After finding this forum and thread, I did some more Googling and found I could buy the EX wheels, wheel caps, Odyssey tire pressure sensors, a temporary spare tire and a kit that includes the temporary spare wheel and all of the mounting hardware for it for just over $1,000 including shipping to my house from Hondapartswarehouse.com.

$600 more and I now have 4 Michelins that are OEM equipment on the Odyssey EX mounted and balanced on my Odyssey and a spare in the spare compartment.  I went to my local tire dealer, you could probably shop around and do better on the tires, but I wanted to make sure the tire pressure sensors were installed properly and weigh the new wheel/tire combo vs. the old one.

I can get a tire or nail fixed wherever or whenever I need one now.  The EX wheel/tire combo has the same height and width as the PAX setup.  However the EX wheel/tire combo weighs in at 52.5 lbs. each and the PAX wheel/tire combo weighs in at 75 lbs each!  A total savings of 90 lbs of unsprung weight and a gain of 23 lbs of sprung weight for the spare.

I now own an Odyssey Touring equipped as Honda does when they sell it in Canada.  What I have done is what I hope Honda and Michelin end up having to do for all U.S. Odyssey Touring owners as a result of the class action lawsuit.  Unfortunately, I suspect we will all get "valuable coupons" from Honda and Michelin, while the lawyers get cash.  

I have a 2005 touring modle so yes I am blessed with the pax tire nightmare. I am intrested in doing the rim and tire replacement. My question is. Dose changing out your rims and tires void your warranty in any way? Has anyone had to deal with this problem?  

At this point my 3yr/36k bumper to bumper warranty is over.  I think there is still a 5yr/60k powertrain warranty, though.  If something else craps out and my dealer says it's not covered because I've voided the warranty, you can be sure I'll be in touch with Honda HQ.  I would then press them on why my discontinued use of PAX tires and wheels caused something else to fail and also to prove to me that the EX version or Canadian Touring edition, which both come without the lovely PAX tires and wheels, have a different spec than a US Touring edition for whatever part it was that failed.  

I have a 2005 Odyssey with the PAX system.  However today is my lucky day.  I found this website this morning and have read thru this thread.  This morning I orderd 4 new 16"EX wheels, caps and sensors.  I should have the equip by next Wed and we will be on our way to normal tires.  Thanks everyone for the great info.  

>My question is. Does changing out your rims and tires void your warranty in any way? Has anyone had to deal with this problem?

No.  This is a common misconception and many dealers prey on people who have made minor (or even major) changes in their vehicle by trying to convince them that these changes have invalidated their warrant.

Here are the facts:  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson-Moss_Warranty_Act

and

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/warranty.shtm

Hope this helps.  

I just completed a wheel/tire swap on my 05 Odyssey touring and am completely happy.  I bought split spoke wheels off an 07 Acura MDX from an Acura dealer on ebay (less than 100 miles on wheels/tires).  Wheels came with Michelin tires and I had 05 Odyssey tpms sensors installed.  Complete package delivered to my door was $875.  Wheels/tires fit perfectly and tpms works fine.  They are 18X8 rims with 255/55/18 tires.  It's an aggessive look and I like it much better than the OEM system since I don't have to worry about being held hostage to one specific tire and a broken logistic support system.  Details can be found on the attached link -- Thanks for all the info on this thread - it was very helpful.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150141101114  

Please check the link below, I just bought the set and it works perfectly. My PAX is just 17K, but I want a peace of mind. Now I free to go with any tires I want. He is excelent seller.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320172109804&sspagename=ADME:X:RTQ:US:11