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honda odyssey PAX system

 
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tkk tkk
New User | Posts: 2 | Joined: 06/07
Posted: 06/06/07
07:23 AM

I believe you are automatically part of the class action suit unless you "opt out".

I went to this website: http://www.sfmslaw.com/pages/cases.php?id=343

for details.  I also emailed the website above and received an email from one of the attorneys (email address: "mark at kabolaw.com") that stated:

Ladies & Gentlemen:



               My co counsel and I filed a class action against American  Honda and Michelin alleging that the PAX system is defective and that Honda misrepresented the PAX system. A copy of the complaint is attached.



               If the court certifies the case as a class action, you will get a notice. If there is a settlement proposed, you will get a notice. You  need not do anything to be part of the class at this time.



               Thank you for your interest in this case.



Mark F Anderson

Kemnitzer, Anderson, Barron, Ogilvie & Brewer LLP

445 Bush Street, 6th Floor

San Francisco, CA 94108-3727

Phone: 415.623.3784, ext 101

Fax: 415.861.3151

Email: mark[at]kabolaw.com
==================End of Email==================

I hope something good comes of this class action suit...  
--
tkk

geoffry geoffry
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 06/07
Posted: 06/07/07
06:42 PM

I agree, the Honda PAC tires are a ripoff.  Once I went to get the annualy safety check on my van and it failed due to the tires wearing.  I have 30K miles and only the right two are wearing ont he edges.  Bottom line....I cannot drive the van with a valid safety until I get two new tires.  Problem.....only single source in Hawaii is at the dealer...and the Michelon forum states that PAX tires will run 10-15% more than normal Michelon tire....load of crap,,,,dealer wants $1,200.00 per tire pluse $89.00 for mounting and $80.00 for something called a chemical kit????

I plan on getting the van tires (Because I have not other option), selling the van, and NEVER buying a HONDA Again....this is my response to Honda for holding us hostage here in Hawaii.  

uniforms uniforms
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 06/07
Posted: 06/09/07
05:07 PM

I had bought a 2006 Honda Odyssey Touring February 2006.   I put 37,000 miles on it.   It was a perfect vechicle except for one thing.  PAX tires!  They are the worst creation Honda and Michelin ever made.  I had two flats with both I lost a whole day of work to have the tire fixed.  I was told it would cost 400 to 500 to replace the tires.   I called Honda and Michelin to change my tires to regular ones.  They told me it was not possible.  They told me what a great safty feature run flats were, and I told them what a safty hazard it would be it to drive 50 miles an hour on the Garden State Parkway or NJ Turnpike!  I couldn't take the chance of being stuck in the middle of nowhere without a way to fix a tire.   So I traded the van in for a Toyota Sienna with good ol' regular tires that get flat, but only require a plug to fix and usually in less than 30 minutes!  Although I got a good deal trading in the van (fearing the value would go down due to Pax tires) I still feel majorly ripped off.  If anyone knows of a class action lawsuit against Honda and Michelin I'd love to join.  This is a major consomer ripoff!  

gregandshannon gregandshannon
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 06/07
Posted: 06/17/07
01:02 PM

A CONVERSION CAN BE DONE - COSTLY - BUT IT WILL BE CHEAPER IN THE LONG RUN.

We have a 2005 Honda Odyssey Touring Edition:

After reading all the message threads from those who have tried to convert out of these God awful PAX tires and resigning ourselves that we've bought into this problem... my wife and I decided to buy another full set of these things.  To make a very long story short, we dropped $995.00 on four new PAX tires.  The first day out the wheel shook so violently because of the challenges surrounding balancing these nightmare tires, that we couldn't get the car over 55 mph and keep the car under control.  We looked online and found similar threads of people stating that the balancing and vibrating of the car was just as common out there as were the challenges in getting out of the wheels altogether.  We decided to roll the dice and bail on the PAX system entirely.

SOLUTION:  Town Fair Tire (local New England Chain) found ASA JH3 17 inch wheels that fit our 2005 Odyssey no problem.  They then added MasterCraft Sensys 01 265/60R17T tires AND (best of all) used the existing TPMS sensors from the original PAX tires.  All told, the new wheels and tires cost us $1408.  A full size spare is gonna run an additional +/- $250.  This sucks - but - we can expect to get in the range of 60K miles out of these rather than the 35K that we got out of the PAX and the tires will cost around $135/tire to replace rather than the $200+ for the PAX that will only get us 35K miles and are a nightmare to install for everyone involved.

In the long run, when we will have done a little better than "breaking even" when we replace the tires again in 60K from now.

Pain in the butt - yes - but the tires and the van run great and we're happy to be rid of the PAX system.  

purplepgt purplepgt
New User | Posts: 2 | Joined: 06/07
Posted: 06/18/07
07:55 PM

Can you give more specs on the tire wheel combo you used as well as if this swap is affecting your warr. or milage? thanx, purplepgt  

jonnybluetoo jonnybluetoo
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 06/07
Posted: 06/21/07
10:03 AM

Dear no more PAX,
I went to the Tire rack web site but couldn't get figure out how to get beyond the make and model issue. What rims did you purchase for your Odyssey

Thanks for your insight!

Jon  

purplepgt purplepgt
New User | Posts: 2 | Joined: 06/07
Posted: 06/21/07
12:48 PM

I called Tire Rack, no help what so ever Confused "No More PAX" must have figured out a combo that worked and just ordered?

Anyone else out there that knows the details of a tire/whl swap?  

medicinsructor medicinsructor
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 07/07
Posted: 07/03/07
11:41 AM

Does anyone have any idea if i can replace the entire wheel and tire with something else for now and then put the originals back on when i return the Honda? i have 18 months left on a lease and need new tires. It seems rediculous to pay that amount of money for 18 months
Thanks  

cedarparkhonda cedarparkhonda
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 07/07
Posted: 07/11/07
06:08 PM

Purplepgt, I also called TireRack.  They weren't helpful, the reps were downright snotty.  look back at some of the first posts on this topic and one of the posters lists out the equipment he purchased.  Good luck!  

DrOfSmiles DrOfSmiles
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 07/07
Posted: 07/21/07
07:25 AM

"pjcesq"...the new wheels and tires that you purchesed (Ronal)to replace the crap that was on the odyssey..where did you get them and how much?  Also you state that the sensors work on the new rims...with regular tires..?  Please tell everyone how to convert and save us all the trouble of the PAX System...PLEASE!!!  

joed-#001 joed-#001
New User | Posts: 47 | Joined: 05/06
Posted: 07/22/07
10:02 AM

I have an '05 Sienna & had the same probs. After a class action lawsuit was filed and settled, Toyota extended the 3yr, 36K mile warranty of the van to the tires. At 35K miles, I'm on my 3rd set of run flats; the original & 1st replacement were Dunlops, 2nd replacement is Bridgestone. The run flat concept is good but the reality is a nightmare.  

JerryR JerryR
New User | Posts: 3 | Joined: 07/07
Posted: 07/24/07
11:34 AM

I guess I should consider myself lucky. I bought a new 2005 Odyssey Touring in January, 2005. I now have over 52,000 miles on it - with the original Michelin PAX system tires - and, I fully expect to not have to replace them before 60,000 miles at the earliest.
I am, however, fastidious about regular tire rotation (every other oil change which equals every 6,000 miles) and maintaining proper tire pressure. I recently had my first need for tire repair on one of the PAX tires - had a large screw in it - which the PAX warning system made me aware of when the tire pressure dropped to the warning level. The dealer was able to repair it (plugged it) and the cost to me was nothing - as I had purchased the Tire Road Hazard warranty when I purchased the Odyssey. I very much appreciate the security offered to me by run flat tire technology. So far, the PAX system on my vehicle has performed exactly as it was designed to. I feel bad that so many people have had problems with this system. I hope you all find some resolution soon.  

Cisco289 Cisco289
New User | Posts: 1 | Joined: 07/07
Posted: 07/26/07
07:56 AM

Same problem with Honda & Michelin....2006 Odyssey Touring........27,000 miles........outside wear on all four tires.....Dealer guaranteed minimal 35,000 miles at time of purchase.....Now dealer says tires must be replaced, no warranty, replace all four tires costs $1,300.00 dollars to correct their mistake...........Class Action lawsuit is a must  

JerryR JerryR
New User | Posts: 3 | Joined: 07/07
Posted: 08/30/07
07:52 AM

My Odyssey is at Belle Tire right now having all four tires replaced to the tune of $1,000. I don't feel too bad about it since I have 55,000 miles on the original Pax tires. Probably could have gone another 5-8,000 miles but with winter coming, I didn't want to wait. Yes, it's a lot of $$ for a set of tires but I likely would have paid $600 or more for "regular" tires and the peace of mind offered by the Pax system is somewhat comforting. The Honda dealer where I purchased the van wanted $1,700!!! I sure hope that the dealers are warning potential buyers of what to expect when it comes time for tire replacement. Here in Toledo, Ohio, there are only three Michelin dealers who can even handle the replacement and two of them are the local Honda dealers.  

GeorgeHH GeorgeHH
New User | Posts: 2 | Joined: 09/07
Posted: 09/14/07
01:03 PM

June 2007

Can this tire be repaired or replaced? It is extremely difficult and may be impossible unless you have your Odyssey towed 100s of miles to a dealership that has the PAX Tire changing equipment.

Honda and Michelin have teamed up to install the PAX (run flat) tires on some of the Honda models. The PAX tire is a Michelin tire that gets about half the tread wear of a normal Michelin (25 to 30 k vs. 50 to 60k miles of wear), costs five times as much, and takes all day to change a set of four. The PAX tire is extremely hard to balance and comes with a Tire Pressure Monitoring System that is difficult to work with when the tire is dismounted. Also, if you have PAX tires on your car, then your car does not come equipped with a spare tire. Not only that, nobody carries or can install the PAX tire except a Honda dealership (there is one exception to that in the Bay Area). Then, once you arrive at the dealer, the PAX tires may not be in stock and will have to be ordered, which could take days. I have just spent the last three weeks trying to have two PAX tires installed, balanced and the monitoring system calibrated correctly on my 2006 Honda Odyssey Touring.  None of the problems were disclosed when I purchased the car. So when I wanted to change the two front tires on my Odyssey and expected it to be done in half an hour at the local tire dealer, I received a big shock. It has now taken over three weeks and the job is still not right.
It all started when I went to a tire dealer that sells Michelin Tires to buy two replacements. I was told that the PAX tire could only be changed at a place with techs certified to operate the very dangerous $15,000 PAX tire installation machine. The only place they knew of was a Honda Dealership. I received an insurance quote from the dealer of $1,491 ($1,116 for two tires plus labor of $375) and take up to 3 hours per tire depending on the tech that did the job (fast is considered 1.5 hours/tire)! Also, they told me, I would have to leave the car for the day and rent a car. It gets worse! I called to make sure they had the tires in stock. They said they did and to go ahead and bring the car in. After renting a car and returning, home, I called to ask what time I could pick it up. They said three days because the tires had to be ordered. That’s right, three days and this was after I was told that they had the tires at the dealership.
If I am having this much trouble here in the Bay Area (Oakland/San Francisco) then what about other locations, like Nevada. I called Honda to seek information and see what the options were there. Jose Acosta of Honda of America said there are no facilities in Nevada and that I would have to get the car back to California. OK, the PAX can be driven 120 miles at 50 miles/hr but since there is no spare, after the 120 miles, I would have to have a tow or leave it.  Then on top of that I would have to wait for the tires to arrive at the dealership before they could be installed. Great vacation? “What about the towing charges”, I asked? Jose said that Honda would probably  take care of the charges. That’s reassuring, convenient too??? With the PAX tire, No Way!!!  Convenient, you bet???
I have called Honda of America many times to see if there is a problem with changing from the PAX system to conventional tires and rims? Jose Acosta wouldn’t say but he did say that Honda of American would not allow it’s dealerships to change them over. He told me that since he is not a tech he could not tell me why and that I should call the dealership. I told him that I had called and that they did not have an answer. I suggested that he call and he said he would and then he said that the dealersip would probably not know. “But wait”, I said, “You just told me to call and ask them, are you saying nobody at Honda knows how the Odyssey Touring works?” He had no answer.
The PAX tires are a major disappointment and I will not buy any car that has them installed. The PAX is short on wear, very expensive, and, assuming you can find the tires, machine and tech to install them, time consuming and difficult to replace. Is this the wave of the future? Convenient? No way!!!  

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